(Alex Strauch noted that some churches may actually have difficulty implementing a biblical form of church leadership unless they adopt the terminology of pastors to describe all the church elders.). To my thinking prophecy is one thing. If youd like to submit a challenge of your own, let me know! . This would have an immediate impact on office staff, phone usage, and the ministries of David Livingston (E1) and Tom Steller (E2). The average salary for a lead pastor is $70,051 per year, while the average salary for a senior pastor is $70,077 per year. What I DO (forgive my capitalizations but its the only way I know how to draw attention to a word in the comments) see however is a degree of openness that we do not generally practice in our church meetings today. Hope that helps! Both lead pastors and senior pastors require excellent communication skills. . On the one hand, pastors should not give in to carnal pressures to do a thousand other tasks than preaching and teaching. Could someone be given by God a gift of shepherding but not use that giftnot function in shepherding ministry? The Scriptures dont give us a model order of service for a church gathering, and different churches are going to find different balances. Marleen. Therefore, I exhort the elders among you, as your fellow elder and witness of the sufferings of Christ, and a partaker also of the glory that is to be revealed, shepherd the flock of God among you, exercising oversight not under compulsion, but voluntarily, according to the will of God; and not for sordid gain, but with eagerness; nor yet as lording it over those allotted to your charge, but proving to be examples to the flock. The verses and chapters you quote are really helpful. Right? We also dont want to diminish the crucial role of teaching in the life of the gathered church. This is an example of whats called an exegetical fallacy (an error in interpreting Scripture). An Associate pastor is the second person in charge of the Senior or Lead pastor. The arrangement gave us remarkable flexibility in our first year. The passage says nothing about such a gift. However, especially in leaner seasons, when there is tension within the church or even within the staff, the more unpaid pastors, the better. For if that is what he said then surely there IS a way to do that (regardless of our experience so far to the contrary). Curtsomething messed up the link through my name in the previous post. Do you believe prophets are for today Jason? The Case for the Senior Pastor Article 08.29.2011 I am a member of a congregationalist church. We have it in Luke 10:7 (and Matthew 10:10): the laborer deserves his wages.. I was looking at the list of gifts as a list of gifts and not a list of gifted ones. The life and gifting of the Spirit must flow, but it must flow through appropriate channels. There are some basic no brainer things that make a great Lead and Executive Pastor partnership and of course trust is at the foundation of it. Also, I spent a few years in the house church movement, so I understand the push for open, participatory meetings. Most such insight is locked under a tradition that sees the pastoral role as more important and needful for the well being of the church such that the Pastor of today is given cart blanche to speak out as he might wish to do while the rest of us are pretty much tied to the pew where we are expected to be docile and uncommunicative of what God is doing in our lives. . This gives them valuable experience, on-the-job training, and mentoring from the Lead Pastor. The one refers to what they do watching over the flock the latter refers to the maturity of the man in that position. As for there being other verses that instruct us to have completely open meetings (i.e. I understand what you are saying about what is most edifying being uppermost in Pauls mind when he wrote what he did. Its also why some elders will specially dedicate themselves to a ministry of laboring in studying the Word and communicating the content. In this healthy mix of both paid and unpaid, staff and non-staff pastors, we want to keep two truths in mind truths that correspond to the two functions of pastor-elders in the New Testament. He doesnt demean the gift of tongues but does show that, in the church assembly, prophecy is generally more useful for edification. It would require not only initial conceptual planning, but weekly design and interaction from someone. When the Spirit speaks to us through the Word, is it only through random and haphazard (to us) Scriptural passages, or does he speak to us and lead us through our systematic study of the Bible as well? I hope to get more time to think through what youve written on your site in the next few days. Senior Pastor Hilltown Baptist Church. The idea that Paul was teaching a completely open church meeting in verse 26 would mean by necessity that he was contradicting himself in the following verses. One with a gift of teaching is by no means more important than one with a gift of administration or one with a gift of counseling. Thanks so very much for your added input bro! Your neighbors are receptive to invitations to church. . "Let the elders who rule well be counted worthy of double honor, especially those who labor in the word and doctrine" (1 Tim. Its fitting that a tentmaker construct the argument; neither Christian maturity nor love insists on its own rights, and so Paul lays out the case for others, for pastors in his day and ours. Id like to also briefly address what you said about my comment to Jason if I might Curt. To be honest, Curt, I havent read the rest of your blog with the exception of your post about Timothy and Titus which obviously is related to this one. All of our resources exist to guide you toward everlasting joy in Jesus Christ. But that something must be brought to edify others. We have just escaped. Hi, Patt. They must allow two or three prophets to speak (again, its allowed but not necessary), but no more than three, they must relinquish the floor if another prophet has something to share, and the prophecy must be properly evaluated to see if its legitimate. Even if that pastor incorrectly is in charge of the church, it doesnt negate his spiritual gifting of teaching that the Lord has given. And you also rightly point out the need for elders to teach. Pastor/Senior Pastor First Baptist Church of Pavilion. You will not find the gift of shepherding explicitly associated with oversight or authority or anything else that is normally associated with church leadership anywhere in the New Testament. On the other hand, it is naive to think they can only preach and teach. Must a church have elders to be a church? Enter your email address to subscribe to this blog and receive notifications of new posts by email. Unfortunately, we also have way too many examples showing how dangerous this kind of centralized power can be. Dental Technician vs. Dentist: What Are the Differences? Here are a few more thoughts regarding gifting and function: Can a believer have a spiritual gift but not faithfully exercise that gift? I want to bring a doctrine to the Body assembled. After completing their seminary, Bible College, or training program (or often at the same time), pastoral candidates will usually spend at least a year working in a church as a Youth Pastor, Assistant Pastor, or some other position under the Senior Pastor. Thankfully, the risen Christ provided. I dont really see how it could be otherwise in the context and in the flow of what Paul is saying. Can Christ AND an elder both lead a man at the same time? Chris, your story is a hard one to read but, sadly, all too common. I too am involved with Calvary Chapel now and am looking for ways to approach my pastor regarding my disagreement with our structure, but in a gracious way. The church of today greatly confuses things by calling a man in a position of leadership after the name of the gift while limiting what we call elders today to being less than what biblical elders were meant to be. The congregation approved last January a budget which included an Executive Pastors salary for part of 1997. I think the saying is too many cooks in the kitchen? You said This chapter (referring to 1 Corinthians 14) actually gives the churches the responsibility to not leave the meetings totally open guided only by how people feel led by the Spirit.. They were more strapped for funds than a staff-light model, but their young congregation received unusual deposits of pastoral time and attention. In other words every one is to have an opportunity to bring something to the meeting (within his restrictions). I hope youve found a healthier church family. This is still a good principle for us today. The point is the amount of labor (and thus necessity of remuneration), not a division of gifting among the elders (as if some were able to teach and others not). yours in Christ Jesus. For some reason it is nearly impossible for me to get anyone to read much less give me input on what the Lord is teaching me and that I am writing about. Nothing about permission or not and from whom anywhere in the text. I wasnt trying to spam your blog just so you know. i am very aware when reading the terms, leader and overseer etc in English that the meaning in koine greek (according to my own understanding) was something very different. He understands what it's like to be in authority so he has no problem submitting to authority. . However if I may say so Curt and without meaning any disrespect to you at all bro but rather in the interest of continuing our honest and frank discussion may I say that what seems most edifying to you based on your experience is not necessarily what Paul meant in my reading of your input and what is written in the text. (For more on this, see Why We Don't Have a Senior Pastor .) Get it wrong, and well, its going to be tough sledding. I hope you dont mind bro but I will take the liberty of only addressing one point per post to keep my responses organized. I do not mean all at the same time Curt or in any other manner that is completely chaotic, unloving, or otherwise of the flesh and not the Spirit. The lead pastor and senior pastor are both important roles within the church. The primary role of the Senior Pastor in relation to the church leadership is to give solid biblical orientation and joyful biblical inspiration. 2. Elder and overseer are different terms for the same church office, and pastor describes the function of these leaders (what they do, i.e. Quora - A place to share knowledge and better understand the world The common perspective (of these five gits being given to to equip the rest of us) exalts the position of the Pastor way beyond what the Lord intended for this position then becomes absolutely vital to the well being of the church. when you come together, every one of you has a psalm, has a doctrine, has a tongue, has a revelation, has an interpretation. Organized ahead of time by church leaders? I understand where youre at; Ive had that conversation myself. This is why I noted in the post above: There is no biblical distinction between an elder, an overseer/bishop, and a pastor of a church. For the use of a gift to be edifying, it must be clear; it must be discernible and meaningful to those for whom its intended; the use of the gift must be orderly and not chaotic; it must be in harmony with the rest of the body; etc. I appreciate the encouragement. Currently, Im teaching the book of Revelation. You saidCarlos, I noticed you seem a little put off by sitting in a pew and listening to a pastor preach.. The term "pastor" also relates to the role of elder within the New Testament, and is synonymous with the biblical understanding of minister.The term Pastor, Shepherd, and Elder are all the same position. I absolutely agree with you Curt that we should not read into the Scriptures something they do not say but I would disagree that 1 Corinthians 14 is not clear in saying that prophets are to speak out openly when the LORD gives them a revelation. Great article, very interesting. The Corinthian church was not lacking in any spiritual gift, but it was severely lacking in spiritual maturity, to the point where they were quarreling and dividing with/from each other. Its getting late here and Im heading to bed. If you spent your entire life in one denomination or fellowship, you may think the names used for church staff are uniform. Carlos, I appreciate your diligence to finding the Truth. Thanks for your understanding on the link Curt. However I think you are misunderstanding some things I have said or perhaps I am misunderstanding some things you have said.